Rules for Radicals - Saul Alinsky

[Nobody]

BUY this book and READ it NOW! If you are going to be an involved activist, you must have this knowledge in your head.

http://www.amazon.com/Rules-Radicals-Saul-Alinsky/dp/0679721134

[JT Keller]

BUY this book and READ it NOW! If you are going to be an involved activist, you must have this knowledge in your head.

http://www.amazon.com/Rules-Radicals-Saul-Alinsky/dp/0679721134

Nobody,

Considering that the playbook is being played out each and every day down in the den of iniquity that is D.C., why on earth would anyone want to read that watermelon nonsense? Don't mean to be harsh here, but those of us who genuinely care about our country ought to be reading books about abolishing the federal reserve system and how to outlaw lobbyists and lobbying. The elections will take care of themselves, and this bunch of lawless, godless profligates will be evicted, and hopefully banned from public life from now on.

JT

[ben fowler]

Why and the heck do we need to read any of the socialist B.S.?? We all know what they are doing and are already following his, and that dude who wrote the socialist guide book in prison!! I'm sorry but i cant bring myself to read anything by a socialist, communist or who ever. We see it happening everyday, i damnd sure don't have to read their crap!!

[JT Keller]

Why and the heck do we need to read any of the socialist B.S.?? We all know what they are doing and are already following his, and that dude who wrote the socialist guide book in prison!! I'm sorry but i cant bring myself to read anything by a socialist, communist or who ever. We see it happening everyday, i damnd sure don't have to read their crap!!

Hello Ben,

Right on brother. Could not have said it better myself.

JT

[Debbie.Jeff]

I don't think Nobody was promoting that book for the purpose of learning to become Alinsky's diciples.

I suspect he's recommending that we read the book in order to understand the mind games and use it, via common sense, to beat the radicals' games.

Bottom line --- knowledge is power therefore make it the conservatives' advantage over the radicals.

[JT Keller]

I don't think Nobody was promoting that book for the purpose of learning to become Alinsky's diciples.

I suspect he's recommending that we read the book in order to understand the mind games and use it, via common sense, to beat the radicals' games.

Bottom line --- knowledge is power therefore make it the conservatives' advantage over the radicals.

Really????? I wrote about this in my first response. We get the playbook with audibles every single day. Why, then, would anyone bother to read it? We are beating them anyway, in fact, they are beating themselves. The truth is on our side, all we have to do is tell it, and we win.
JT

[Nobody]

Knowledge is power. Ignorance is kryptonite.

[JT Keller]

Knowledge is power. Ignorance is kryptonite.

Are you saying that I am ignorant because I choose not read another communist manifesto? Nobody, we get the play by play every single day, often times, many times a day. I choose to arm myself with the writings of our Founding Fathers. Is that ignorant in your opinion too? Communists, Fascists, and Socialists did not make this country Nobody, self educated men who valued utility did. This is what I am concerned with, it is my ammunition, and it is the truth. The truth will prevail here, not some collective rubbish. Just in case you missed it, some two-thirds of the country disagrees with 44 and collective, redistributive, and dictatorial nonsense (there is another word that applies here). I suggest that you read Jefferson, Washington, Madison, and Franklin. Because, as you say, "knowledge is power: and ignorance is kryptonite."


JT

[Nobody]

Are you saying that I am ignorant because I choose not read another communist manifesto? Nobody, we get the play by play every single day, often times, many times a day. I choose to arm myself with the writings of our Founding Fathers. Is that ignorant in your opinion too? Communists, Fascists, and Socialists did not make this country Nobody, self educated men who valued utility did. This is what I am concerned with, it is my ammunition, and it is the truth. The truth will prevail here, not some collective rubbish. Just in case you missed it, some two-thirds of the country disagrees with 44 and collective, redistributive, and dictatorial nonsense (there is another word that applies here). I suggest that you read Jefferson, Washington, Madison, and Franklin. Because, as you say, "knowledge is power: and ignorance is kryptonite."


JT

Touchy touchy touchy! I was speaking in general terms. I was not calling YOU ignorant. Personally, I choose to read everything I can get my hands on.

[Nobody]

btw... I just read Franklin's autobiography. Now I am going to read The Emperor Wears No Clothes by Jack Herer.

You may not be completely ignorant. But you are most definitely condescending and rude.

[JT Keller]

btw... I just read Franklin's autobiography. Now I am going to read The Emperor Wears No Clothes by Jack Herer.

You may not be completely ignorant. But you are most definitely condescending and rude.

Sticks and stones Nobody, sticks and stones. Having my intelligence and character attacked by a liberal is hardly a new thing for me. Have a nice day.

JT

[Nobody]

Sticks and stones Nobody, sticks and stones. Having my intelligence and character attacked by a liberal is hardly a new thing for me. Have a nice day.

JT


What the heck are you saying? You think I'm a... liberal? Now those are fighting words, pal. If you picked up a copy of Rules for Radicals and READ IT you would see that the "rules" are not for liberals. They are for radicals. And if God fearing, Star Spangled Banner loving AMERICANS are the radicals of the day, then these rules are for YOU, too!

Sticks and stones. Puleze!

[Debbie.Jeff]

JT,

Based on reading your posts in different threads, including this thread, it is pretty clear to me that you're angry. You're venting here. It is also pretty clear to me that you are extremely worried -- that is understandable.

Venting here and/or being worried are not the problem here. However, reading between the lines in people's posts as well as making accusations and/or characterize the poster, presents a potentially big problem.

In no way, shape or form am I saying that you're paranoid. That would not be a fair statement. However, I am saying that you're a very concerned American citizen who has a heavy burden on his shoulders.

I don't know what happened to you, JT. Some, if not all of us, don't know what happened to you when you went MIA. We welcomed you back and were happy to see you back.

We are not your enemies and we are not making any "hidden" comments inside of our posts. There are no hidden agendas nor are we making any attempt to hurt you.

[Nobody]

Ahh. Okay. I am kind of new here. I guess there is some history that I was unaware of.

Hey JT. I am not really concerned with ideology. Especially ideology based on subjective morality. I am all about problem solving. And our beautiful country has huge problems to solve. Anger and polarization will not get the job done. For the record: In 1976, when I was 18, I voted for Jimmy Carter. In 1980 I voted for Ronald Reagan. In 1984 I became a Libertarian and voted for David Bergland. I have been a registered Libertarian ever since. Have a nice day. Peace.

(A liberal. Sheesh.)

[Debbie.Jeff]

.......(A liberal. Sheesh.)

I hear ya, Nobody. I hear ya! :D

[JT Keller]

Ahh. Okay. I am kind of new here. I guess there is some history that I was unaware of.

Hey JT. I am not really concerned with ideology. Especially ideology based on subjective morality. I am all about problem solving. And our beautiful country has huge problems to solve. Anger and polarization will not get the job done. For the record: In 1976, when I was 18, I voted for Jimmy Carter. In 1980 I voted for Ronald Reagan. In 1984 I became a Libertarian and voted for David Bergland. I have been a registered Libertarian ever since. Have a nice day. Peace.

(A liberal. Sheesh.)

Nobody,
I'm not real concerned with ideology either, except that which is anti-democratic. Truce?

JT

[JT Keller]

JT,

Based on reading your posts in different threads, including this thread, it is pretty clear to me that you're angry. You're venting here. It is also pretty clear to me that you are extremely worried -- that is understandable.

Venting here and/or being worried are not the problem here. However, reading between the lines in people's posts as well as making accusations and/or characterize the poster, presents a potentially big problem.

In no way, shape or form am I saying that you're paranoid. That would not be a fair statement. However, I am saying that you're a very concerned American citizen who has a heavy burden on his shoulders.

I don't know what happened to you, JT. Some, if not all of us, don't know what happened to you when you went MIA. We welcomed you back and were happy to see you back.

We are not your enemies and we are not making any "hidden" comments inside of our posts. There are no hidden agendas nor are we making any attempt to hurt you.

Debbie,
I call them like I see them. If that is a problem, then so be it. I have no idea whatsoever what you are rambling about. Whatever this ramble is about should have been through private message.
JT

[Debbie.Jeff]

Debbie,
I call them like I see them. If that is a problem, then so be it. I have no idea whatsoever what you are rambling about. Whatever this ramble is about should have been through private message.
JT

What goes around, comes around. To pin that on me and/or Nobody is NOT appreciated. :mad:

However, I do concur that you should have rambled, via private messages. I would have reciprocated in kind, via private message. I know this would have avoided discomfort for readers.

Enough said. :cool:

[JT Keller]

What goes around, comes around. To pin that on me and/or Nobody is NOT appreciated. :mad:

However, I do concur that you should have rambled, via private messages. I would have reciprocated in kind, via private message. I know this would have avoided discomfort for readers.

Enough said. :cool:

Like I said, I call them like I see them. You posted for all to see something about my personal life that certainly was not intended for public use. That is certainly not appreciated, nor is it deserved. Had you bothered to read it, there was an explanation detailing the reasons of my leave of absence in a restricted section. As for being angry, I was not angry until I read your post throwing me under the bus pretty good. As for nobody, there have been numerous instances of lefties infiltrating this site (or are you going to deny that too?) thought he might be one. Rules for Radicals isn't exactly everyday reading for conservatives. Nobody and myself were having a lively debate that turned personal and barbs were exchanged. Nobody, I apologize for mistakenly calling you a liberal. Debbie, I'm not sure what's happened here, but I do feel that you owe me an apology for posting private info about me. I did apologize for "barking" at you. In this thread I have nothing to apologize to you for, and stand by my comments.


JT

JT

[Nobody]

Nobody,
I'm not real concerned with ideology either, except that which is anti-democratic. Truce?

JT

Truce? Never knew we were at war! It's all good. Peace to you!

[JT Keller]

Truce? Never knew we were at war! It's all good. Peace to you!

It was a mistake for me to call you a liberal and for me to get personal. We have had a number of trolls in here, and mistakenly I thought you might be one. Peace to you too.

JT

[Debbie.Jeff]

Like I said, I call them like I see them. You posted for all to see something about my personal life that certainly was not intended for public use. That is certainly not appreciated, nor is it deserved. Had you bothered to read it, there was an explanation detailing the reasons of my leave of absence in a restricted section. As for being angry, I was not angry until I read your post throwing me under the bus pretty good. As for nobody, there have been numerous instances of lefties infiltrating this site (or are you going to deny that too?) thought he might be one. Rules for Radicals isn't exactly everyday reading for conservatives. Nobody and myself were having a lively debate that turned personal and barbs were exchanged. Nobody, I apologize for mistakenly calling you a liberal. Debbie, I'm not sure what's happened here, but I do feel that you owe me an apology for posting private info about me. I did apologize for "barking" at you. In this thread I have nothing to apologize to you for, and stand by my comments.


JT

JT

Excuse me?!? :mad:

I betrayed you?!?! What personal DETAILS?!?!

I tried to help you out when you publicly "rambled" for all to read. I tried to help you in vagued way (ie empathy) to readers regarding your vents. At least one person understood enough to give you the benefit of the doubt. You could have bowed out gracefully but instead tried to pass this off as my problem and my fault. That is NOT cool nor nice, JT.

The only apology I owe are to the readers (I'm sorry 912ers). So should you apologize to the readers too, JT.

Now I understand your character better, you are no longer on my list of admirable 912er people. Your future postings will be ignored by me. Have a good life, JT and I mean that sincerely.

[Nobody]

Wow. All I did was recommend a book! And a very interesting book, as well! Just because you do not agree with the author does not mean that there is not much to be learned from the experience of reading this book! This book is packed with info about the psychology and methodology of radicalism. For ALL to use for their own advantage.

But the real reason for this post is to simply say that I posted this post to recommend a book. Not to start a flame war. I come from the old mp3dotcombb school of flaming. And this is pre-school.

So, please grow up kids. We have a country to save.

And if anyone thinks I am a "troll" just go to my website and check it out!

http://nobodyforpresident.net

[Debbie.Jeff]

Wow. All I did was recommend a book! And a very interesting book, as well! Just because you do not agree with the author does not mean that there is not much to be learned from the experience of reading this book! This book is packed with info about the psychology and methodology of radicalism. For ALL to use for their own advantage.

But the real reason for this post is to simply say that I posted this post to recommend a book. Not to start a flame war. I come from the old mp3dotcombb school of flaming. And this is pre-school.

So, please grow up kids. We have a country to save.

And if anyone thinks I am a "troll" just go to my website and check it out!

http://nobodyforpresident.net

I concur with you, Nobody. That is the reason why I made myself very clear in my last post, put JT on my ignore list and ceased any further communications with JT.

When I apologized to the readers in my last post, I also apologize to you.

You weren't the problem, Nobody. Your thread was fine. I tried to help defend you and put JT in a better light, but somehow it didn't help.

BTW -- I enjoyed your faceless picture on your website. Decent website too.

[JT Keller]

Excuse me?!? :mad:

I betrayed you?!?! What personal DETAILS?!?!

I tried to help you out when you publicly "rambled" for all to read. I tried to help you in vagued way (ie empathy) to readers regarding your vents. At least one person understood enough to give you the benefit of the doubt. You could have bowed out gracefully but instead tried to pass this off as my problem and my fault. That is NOT cool nor nice, JT.

The only apology I owe are to the readers (I'm sorry 912ers). So should you apologize to the readers too, JT.

Now I understand your character better, you are no longer on my list of admirable 912er people. Your future postings will be ignored by me. Have a good life, JT and I mean that sincerely.

I think that would be best. Certainly there are many things that could and probably should be said here. Out of respect for the group and our cause, I shall refrain.

JT

[ben fowler]

Nobody ,in reference to your book. I read books about freedom and right's, not books about oppressing people!! I never meant to imply anything here. Just that reading socialist propaganda doesn't sit well with me and i cant bring myself to read one word of their dirty oppressor guides, and in my opinion the only reason anyone would read it is to maybe to make them think along the lines of oppression?? so with that being said feel free to read all the socialist and oppressor books you deem necessary but don't try to push the socialist crap by recommending a book on socialism!!

[Nobody]

Nobody ,in reference to your book. I read books about freedom and right's, not books about oppressing people!! I never meant to imply anything here. Just that reading socialist propaganda doesn't sit well with me and i cant bring myself to read one word of their dirty oppressor guides, and in my opinion the only reason anyone would read it is to maybe to make them think along the lines of oppression?? so with that being said feel free to read all the socialist and oppressor books you deem necessary but don't try to push the socialist crap by recommending a book on socialism!!

The book is not simply socialist propaganda. I look at it as a guide book for ANYONE who is considered a "radical" by their own government! It is a "how to" book for political activists! Of ALL political persuasions!

Also, I resent your assumption that my mission here is to push socialist "crap." Wake up.

[Nobody]

I concur with you, Nobody. That is the reason why I made myself very clear in my last post, put JT on my ignore list and ceased any further communications with JT.

When I apologized to the readers in my last post, I also apologize to you.

You weren't the problem, Nobody. Your thread was fine. I tried to help defend you and put JT in a better light, but somehow it didn't help.

BTW -- I enjoyed your faceless picture on your website. Decent website too.


Thank you! Glad you dug it!

[Mom4liberty]

HaverRead the Communist Manifesto, Stalin's Memoires, etc. etc. Does not make me a Communist or a Socialist, it just gives me a deeper understanding how they think, how they plan, why they are SO very demented and WRONG. The problem with rules for radicals (what I have read of it) is that no moral person would be willing to sell out their soul to win using these tactics. The end does not justify the means etc.

When I was in school before we could become Confirmed in our religion we spent two years studying and exploring other religions and cults. The purpose behind that was so that when the time came to Confirm one's beliefs, they were rock solid. Not only did we know what we believed and why we believed it, we also knew what we DID NOT believe, and why. It was a vow of both faith and knowledge.

I will not give money to the author, his affiliates or publishers by buying the book; there are plenty of other sources for that both on and off line like the library, etc. but I think Nobody has a logical point. Know thy enemy~

[Nobody]

HAHAHA! This thread is STILL at the top! I guess I am the only one out here who reads! HAHAHA!

[Referee]

I read your post. Didn't particularly find it as funny as you, :rolleyes: but I read it. I guess that makes everything you have ever said in your entire lifetime completely and utterly Obamalike, otherwise known as untrue. Or as the distinguished congressman from South Carolina so eloquently said, "You Lie!!!" Ok, maybe not, but so what, everything doesn't always have to be about you. Toby Keith says it best in his song, "I Wanna Talk about Me". (I AM joking, okay?!)

As to the bickering, (in my best possible Obama imitation) "Well ahh... Can't we all just... no wait, go back... you're turning the pages too fast! What the HELL!!! Is that YOU Hillary?"

Life is too short to take everything said by friends too seriously. :eek: Except if it was said by me... and it's funny... unless I want you to be mad at me... at which time I would tell you that you could be mad at me... otherwise you are to be happy with me... have I suceeded in confusing you... :confused:

Remember the words of that famous lyricist Bobby McFerrin who sang the song with the most annoying tune, "Don't Worry, Be Crappy!" I mean Happy. :D

BTW, what are the symptoms of having a nervous breakdown anyway?

[Referee]

Nobody,

I sincerely hope you took my last post as the humor it was meant to be as far as what I directed to you. The reason I posted was mainly in an attempt to get two people I like to act with civility towards each other again.

Many of us are stressed. Some possibly more than others. Holding onto things that may have upset us in the past, even though no ill will was intended is far too easy for any of us to do. I really think that if all try to be forward looking, though that may seem even more bleak (sp?), and try to find the good that can come of our current situation, we will live happier and less stressful lives. Yes, I suggested we try to be optimistic.

You have no idea how that is so not like me. I was once nominated to be the President of the National Pessimist Society, but I turned it down because I didn't think it would lead anywhere. I have almost never been an optimist. I always seem to focus on what is wrong with an idea or situation. I could find the flaw in almost anything. At one time I really thought these were critical thinking skills, and I suppose if applied appropriately they are. But in focussing myself in the negative of everything, I never see the positive or the potential. I, for one know that this is not who I want to be.

I see all the good folks out here with whom I mostly agree and I am in awe to see that I am not alone in my thinking when it comes to my desire for the overall direction of this country. It thrills me to know that there are those out there like Glenn Beck, who felt there was something wrong, but couldn't quite put a finger on what that something was, and let that motivate them to do hours and hours of research. These fantastic people then cared enough for everyone else, who may have felt the same, and shared what they learned by their research. This act of selflessness displayed by these folks gives me great hope.

When I am at work I tend to get very frustrated by things I believe to be lacking common sense. The good in this tells me it is because I care. The bad comes from my not knowing how to affect constructive change. Far too often I focus on the stupid parts and want to meet them with the repelling force of an anvil being hit by a sledge hammer.

I sincerely want to affect positive change. Sadly, I don't really know how to do so effectively. I'd like to do this where egos aren't bruised by pointing out what I believe to be wrong. The really bad part of this for me lies in the fact that I am most critical of those I love and respect. Then I tend to lash out. This is not who I want to be.

I am working on this about myself. One of the ways I am trying to change is by trying to be more tolerant of differing opinions. <-- Ok, THAT is part of the problem. I should be more respectful and recognize differing opinions are often times caused by variables I may not know exist. None of our lives are, or have been the same. We all have differing experiences that have molded us and our opinions, communications and actions into what they are.

So how does this apply to the situation at hand? One of my friends made a post they thought was private, unaware of the hurt it could cause if it was read by the other friend. Hurt was received and a defensive wall went up. Even though apologies were made, it appears they were never really accepted and the hurt lingered. This hurt appears to have developed into resentment. Now everything posted seems to futher pound a wedge into the relationship.

If we look forward, focussing on the things we CAN change, rather than looking back, dwelling on that which we can not change, everyone benefits.

To my overall like minded friends. Please don't fight. None of it was ever intended to be personal. Effective communication requires that the intended message sent is the message that is received. No harm, no foul. When it comes to personal relationships, look forward to what we CAN do, don't look back.

Now the critical smarta$$ in me has to say, "Can't we all just get along?" (Jokes folks, just jokes.) So you two kiss & make up... okay? Don't take pictures though, cause I for one don't wanna see 'em. I just ate.

Man, am I an a$$hole or what?

[Nobody]

Hi Ref! No offense taken at all! I have just been very busy working on some new music in my real world life, and gearing up for the tax and regulate cannabis campaign here in California! So I have not been on the net much. Peace, and thank you for posting!